Has Windows moved past its prime?

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Has Windows gone past it's prime?

Yes. MS engineers are down to shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic to justify their jobs.
2
33%
No. MS engineers are planning for a Brave New World of OS interaction
2
33%
Other. Explain below but stay on topic
2
33%
 
Total votes: 6

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AArdvark
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Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by AArdvark »

Didja ever wonder about this?

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RealNC
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by RealNC »

Other.

Microsoft's vision for Windows is as a subscription service. This is the ultimate corporate dream. You install Windows and need to pay $10 a month or whatever. If you don't, what remains is a severely crippled computer.

I don't know how long it will take. 5 years, 10, 20... No idea. But it will happen.

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Ice Cream Jonsey
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Ice Cream Jonsey »

Yeah, the OS is a shithole. Whatever used to be good they broke and mess up and I can't remember the last time they had a feature I was happy to get.
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Tdarcos
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Tdarcos »

Other.

One of the things said about Open Source is that those applications don't get to "world class" status until they've been in service, and still recieving maintenance, after ten years. I suspect the same is true for Proptietary Software. Windows-32 bit has been around since 1995, obviously, so the platform has nrrm around 27 years, but how long has 64-bit been out. Probably because they put peoplr on the "upgtade treadmill" where they have to find new ways to get more money. Rgen there's SAAS, where they won't sell you the software anymore, they obly offer it on a "lease" basis, or a website, and you either buy a 1-month license every 30 days, or every yerat.

So I don't think Windows is donr yet. But if anyonr developed an actual competitor good enough to replace it, then all bets are off.
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AArdvark
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by AArdvark »

I saw something about a subscription service and I was wondering why is that something good for the users?
I heard about an open source Windows system but that's not even in beta yet.

I got Win7 exactly the way I want it on my home pc and it does everything flawlessly. I guess if MS stopped selling The White Album over and over to us they would go out of business

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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by pinback »

I mean, it's better at games than anything else. Wanna do something useful, dual boot into Linux. It'll never be past its prime until the "will there be Linux support" Steam threads turn into "will there be windows support?" ones.
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Ice Cream Jonsey
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Ice Cream Jonsey »

pinback wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 6:11 pm I mean, it's better at games than anything else. Wanna do something useful, dual boot into Linux. It'll never be past its prime until the "will there be Linux support" Steam threads turn into "will there be windows support?" ones.
There is a deep wisdom to your words.

The other two operating systems have problems that are so large, you'd never willingly use them for anything. The File Explorer on a Mac is seemingly designed to not let you find your files. I assume it's intentionally designed that way.

I have to keep my Linux machine updated constantly **because there eventually will be no valid upgrade path** if I miss too many updates. I unplugged mine because I wasn't using it for anything, but I am going to have to plug it in pretty soon to not miss out. Stupid.

A deep, throbbing wisdom. Yessir. Thick and meaty, we can play games.

Someone is going to make a lot of money making an actual operating system that runs everything and doesn't have stupid decisions pulling it down. We will look back on these years as the "Bad OS years" and people will use it as a reason why we never put a man back on the moon.
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by pinback »

Deep, penetrating, girthy wisdom.
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Jizaboz
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Jizaboz »

Damn right.

- Windows computer or drive for games, streaming, or other fun things like nudes of your wife/GF on a flash drive or encrypted folder.
- MacOS for any work that doesn't require GPU
- Linux for hacking or also for nudes of your buddy's wife. Either way use a flash drive or encrypted folder.
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Jizaboz
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Jizaboz »

Tdarcos wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 4:05 pm Other.

One of the things said about Open Source is that those applications don't get to "world class" status until they've been in service, and still recieving maintenance, after ten years. I suspect the same is true for Proptietary Software. Windows-32 bit has been around since 1995, obviously, so the platform has nrrm around 27 years, but how long has 64-bit been out. Probably because they put peoplr on the "upgtade treadmill" where they have to find new ways to get more money. Rgen there's SAAS, where they won't sell you the software anymore, they obly offer it on a "lease" basis, or a website, and you either buy a 1-month license every 30 days, or every yerat.

So I don't think Windows is donr yet. But if anyonr developed an actual competitor good enough to replace it, then all bets are off.
Paul brings up a good point. "Wine" AKA "Wine I not an emulator" 32 bit binaries no longer work for things like SCUMM VM, Ultima Online launchers, and countless other programs ever since Apple enforced the "64 bit or GTFO" rule in their latest versions of MacOS.
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Flack
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Flack »

Tdarcos wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 4:05 pm Windows-32 bit has been around since 1995, obviously, so the platform has nrrm around 27 years, but how long has 64-bit been out.
Both Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 were available in 64-bit versions.
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Flack
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Flack »

AArdvark wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 5:00 pm I saw something about a subscription service and I was wondering why is that something good for the users?
As the forum's official Devil's Advocate for Microsoft (D.A.M.), I'll tell you.

Let's use Adobe as an example, and say you wanted to get into layout and design. Although the CS line has been discontinued, Photoshop CS6 sold for $699, Illustrator CS6 was $599, InDesign CS6 was $699. That means dropping $2k on day one just for software licenses. Several years ago, Adobe dropped their CS line and moved to CC, which is all subscription based. You can now get Photoshop and Lightroom for $20/month, which comes with 1TB of cloud storage as well. If you upgrade your copy of Photoshop less than once every three years, the subscription plan is cheaper.

Windows 10 Home Edition sells retail for $140. Remember back when Microsoft used to offer those big SP releases (XP SP2, SP3, etc)? While most people don't realize it, you're now getting those for free. Windows 10 has been overhauled multiple times, with major releases coming out twice a year. We're also all getting monthly updates for free, and out of band updates for free, for at least half a decade. Now that computers aren't doubling in power every six minutes, people are keeping their operating systems longer, which means more free support from Microsoft. Back when people were upgrading their operating systems roughly every three years (Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows 2000...) it made sense financially for them to do that. But when people are still running Windows 7... Windows 7 was released in 2009, 14 years ago. Imagine buying a 2009 Honda and expecting free monthly maintenance and repairs for decades. Great for you, not so great for Honda.

Microsoft's problem (and the problem of every company that makes and distributes operating systems) is that it is in their best interest to keep the operating system safe and secure. If every morning you woke up and hackers had wiped your computer clean, you wouldn't run Windows very long. It is no exaggeration to say that computers running Windows are literally responsible for your health and safety. Nobody (anarchists and terrorists excluded) wants the computers in banks, hospitals, airports, and utility grids to go offline every day. This puts those developers in a bind... on one side you want to keep things safe by issuing patches and updates, and on the other side you have people running Windows 7 and expecting to be protected for decades for free.

In short, a subscription service for Windows workstations is not a great deal for end uses because Microsoft currently gives you upgrades for free. When they move to a subscription model, the only plan that makes sense (and will happen someday) is updates and upgrades will no longer be free. In that world, you'll be paying $140 (or more) for Windows "X" and then paying $5/month for updates, vs. $10/month for the OS and all updates. The other scenario in which this makes sense is the office workplace. Windows 10 Enterprise edition is $300/copy, with an upgrade cycle of roughly every 3 years. At that point, $10/month/machine is a better deal than $300/license, especially when the number of machines you own goes up/down and you are constantly rightsizing your licensing.
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Flack
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Flack »

Also, there is nothing funnier to me than the vapid threat of abandoning Windows for Linux. I remember people threatening to abandon Windows en masse back when Windows 95 was released. It's been nearly 30 years and people (in many cases, the same people) still threaten to do it. The very few who carry through with this threat find themselves retaining a Windows installation for gaming or relying on things like WINE to run Windows software. Every single person who runs Windows and hates it is only a download away from installing Ubuntu, Fedora, or one of the other many free Linux alternatives. Makes you wonder why people would continue to pay for a run the world's most hated operating system.
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by RealNC »

Flack wrote: Tue Jun 07, 2022 8:45 amMakes you wonder why people would continue to pay for a run the world's most hated operating system.
Because of chickens and eggs.

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Tdarcos
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Tdarcos »

AArdvark wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 5:00 pm I saw something about a subscription service and I was wondering why is that something good for the users?[/quore]
It has no benefit to the users and potentially a big drawback. If you buy a software package, you own it and can continue to use it for as long as you want. With SAAS, if you don't pay the license fee every month, for an operating system, your computer can become disabled; for an application, you can be locked out of your data, as the files you worked on are stored in a format no other program can read. If you're an artist, and you get in a dry spell where you're not working, if you can't pay the $60 a month commercial license fee, good luck showing a client your portfolio, you no longer have access to the software, and a new license might require you pay the first year's license fee up front, call it $750. Note that this application, when they sold it, might have cost $600 to purchase. Ir's a way of turning what used to be one-time purchasing customers into a continuing revenue stream, and for more money.
AArdvark wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 5:00 pm I heard about an open source Windows system but that's not even in beta yet.
It won't be any form of Windows; that's too big a cash cow for Microsoft to give away. What is probably being talked about is the new, more attractive windowing managers used by Linux, BSD, and virtually all other graphical user interface, all using the same thing underlying them: Brand X. Or, more precisely, "X Windowing System." New window managers can change the appearance of all the widgets and chrome; some distros can be amazing. Impressive appearances, stunning arrangements of components, colors and effects can be stunningly beautiful. Plus, people's tastes have changed. When Windows 95 came out, the appearance of the new window format: gray with highlighted top of window, square uniform appearance, were all refreshing. Now, it's dated, an application that displayed itself like that would look old (like cars of today made with tail fins and lots of chrome). Yet, what can you say has been changed> We still have rectangular windows, and changing colors and backgrounds has been the same. Ir's more subtle differences, which is why Microsoft is having pushback about pushing another new operating systems: there's really nothing significant worth moving or paying for it. XP gave us improved reliability and stability*. Windows Vista and to a greater extent, Windows 7, gave the new appearances, start menu, and other things.
AArdvark wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 5:00 pm I got Win7 exactly the way I want it on my home pc and it does everything flawlessly. I guess if MS stopped selling The White Album over and over to us they would go out of business
Yeah, because they don't also sell: commercial repository services (GitHub); a search engine (Bing); a software productivity suite (Office: Word, Excel, PowerPoint, etc.); cloud hosting services; Microsoft Press (reference books and other information); and consulting services. Yeah, it's a shame Microsoft doesn't have any of those things for streams of revenue. Oh, wait...


- - -
* Yes, I know, saying Windows XP was more stable and reliable would be laughable if Windows 95/98/Me hadn't drastically lowered the quality bar. Windows systems are quite lucky if they can stay running two weeks without rebooting. Linux systems can potentially remain up and running for months, sometimes even years.
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by pinback »

Reported for incorrect formatting.
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by AArdvark »

He lost his phone, don't judge

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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Ice Cream Jonsey »

REPORTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Has Windows moved past its prime?

Post by Jizaboz »

I'm somehow grandfathered in or something for Windows 10 illegally. I had a pirated copy of 7 ultimate I downloaded off Pirate Bay YEARS ago and eventually when a game (it's always a game) forced me to upgrade to 10, I bit the bullet and tried the auto-update procedure. Went completely smooth and I'm still running that same install of Windows 10 lol

The one and only copy of Windows I ever purchased was Win98 2nd Edition.. and that was only because it was packaged with the Dell Pentium II laptop I was buying for college at the time.

Linux is a different story with games. If you only want to play games like the QUAKE series, Linux I found was actually always superior. However, outside of that there just are not that many native Linux ports for games people want to play.
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