HugoComp Discussion, Reviews n' Spoilers!

This is a discussion / support forum for the Hugo programming language by Kent Tessman. Hugo is a powerful programming language for making text games / interactive fiction with multimedia support.

Hugo download links: https://www.generalcoffee.com/hugo
Roody Yogurt's Hugo Blog: https://notdeadhugo.blogspot.com
The Hugor interpreter by RealNC: http://ifwiki.org/index.php/Hugor

Moderators: Ice Cream Jonsey, joltcountry

Roody_Yogurt
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Post by Roody_Yogurt »

pinback wrote:... that the author didn't just throw up his hands and say "fuck it, it's a mini game" when considering fleshing everything out.
Hugo Clock wrote:>x eyes
You can't poke and prod everything. This is a mini-comp game for crying out loud!
Seriously, though, yeah, the coding behind this (the automaton especially) is pretty amazing for something written so recently. It is far more complicated than the automaton idea I never even got around to coding in my other game idea.

In any case, this was a great surprise. I will write about it further once I have completed it.

P.S. I have powered the machine but am stuck.

P.P.S. All kidding aside, this game has some great extra_scenery responses (which I am a fan of).

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Post by pinback »

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:Unlike Ben, I didn't guess what was happening...
since nobody else mentioned any trouble getting around, I'll assume the implementation was cleaned up
Is it possible that you're just terrible at this?
I don't have to say anything. I'm a doctor, too.

Roody_Yogurt
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Post by Roody_Yogurt »

I floundered there for a bit but eventually figured it out. It would be nice if that were clued (or at least, have some kind of object present representing the ship we are in so when control descriptions are omitted, we know it's intentional).

Whatever, though, I guess. I got it.

Taleslinger

Post by Taleslinger »

Hello fellows!

Thanks for the kind words about my game. I would like to do a rerelease of my game at some point, and I'm wondering if you guys could be a bit more specific about implementations things and spelling errors you found. You can find my contact info in my game's about text. Thanks!

I will write my own reviews of the other games once I'm home today.

See you then!

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Post by Bainespal »

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:World Builder
I cracked up when I saw that the artificial son was named "Hugor." Now, I played an early release of this, and since nobody else mentioned any trouble getting around, I'll assume the implementation was cleaned up after Bainespal got my transcript. I like that he assumed we all knew that the ship should be able to warp/go to light speed/etc.
What exact command did you guys use at that one turn? I wanted to pretend to be Kirk or something for one little turn, so the ideal command in my mind when I was implementing the scene was:

>ENGAGE PHOTON ENGINES
However, I wanted to make my cliched little romp feel a little original, so I wanted to avoid mentioning "warping" at all cost, which I why I came up with the "photon" terminology. For the same reason, I used "engines" in the text instead of "drives". I was kind of reluctant to allow "warp" as a synonym at this point, since my game isn't Star Trek, but I finally got over my reservation after the comp was delayed, because it really is a reasonable verb for players to guess, since most people are familiar enough with Trekky lingo. The other verb that showed up in ICJ's transcript, "accelerate" is also probably more intuitive than trying to turn on an object that is never mentioned in a way that would suggest that it was implemented. ("Engage" performs DoSwitchOn.)
Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:I would consider this to be the kind of "harder" sci-fi that people talk about? I think?
No, I don't think so, at least not by one definition of "hard SF" that I've heard. Some of the science in the setting could just as easily have been magic, if it weren't described with science-sounding words. That means the science fiction isn't all that "hard". I would classify my game as an attempt at space opera, a broad term for far-future stories with interplanetary/interstellar travel. Space opera may or may not be "hard" science fiction, but I think it tends not to be very "hard." The one-season TV show Firefly was an attempt to make a "harder" space opera. All the beaming and warping and stuff in Star Trek isn't that "hard".

The space portal scene was inspired by the jump gates in Babylon 5, which I like better than Star Trek. The whole portal thing was kind of a cross between jump gates and Travelling from The Wheel of Time fantasy novels.

Roody_Yogurt wrote:P.S. I have powered the machine but am stuck.
I also need a hint. I haven't gotten as far as Roody has, I think. Any hints about the main game area would be welcome. (I already got into the Study.)

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Post by pinback »

Bainespal wrote:
Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:World Builder
I cracked up when I saw that the artificial son was named "Hugor." Now, I played an early release of this, and since nobody else mentioned any trouble getting around, I'll assume the implementation was cleaned up after Bainespal got my transcript. I like that he assumed we all knew that the ship should be able to warp/go to light speed/etc.
What exact command did you guys use at that one turn?
"Accelerate."

And ICJ just applies the "hard SF" tag to anything, including frozen chicken finger cooking instructions, he doesn't fully understand after the first 30 seconds.
I don't have to say anything. I'm a doctor, too.

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Ice Cream Jonsey
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Post by Ice Cream Jonsey »

This is true. Here are a list of things I have, at some point, called "hard sci-fi"

* Cloning people
* Shipyards
* Holograms
* Scrubbing Bubbles Dish Soap
* Lemur
* A... robot?
* When Steam Cloudsaves My Savegames
* Magnets
* What Percentage Of My Pay Is "Bonus" vs "Straight Pay"
* Ron Paul
* Dyson Spheres
* Girls
the dark and gritty...Ice Cream Jonsey!

Roody_Yogurt
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Post by Roody_Yogurt »

Ha ha.

Ok, now I will write blurb thoughts on most of the games. Since I think of this forum as our own little Hugo bubble, I'm not going to refrain from pointing out things that I think could improve the respective games; I figure each of us has possible revisions to be made before we upload our games to the ifarchive (I'm thinking we would *not* upload it as a comp so we can start bulking up that /games/hugo directory).

Anyhow, in alphabetical order:

The Hugo Clock by Jason McWright-
This game starts off really strong. I kind of take for granted that ICJ's games will have a color scheme, but I really need to start doing that myself (the game I started writing for the Hugo Comp that didn't make it played around with color a little bit). This game is a good example of how it sets the player off on the right foot, saying, "Hey, this is cool."

The narrative in the beginning is written well and is nicely atmospheric. Technically, the game is very sound. The only thing that really jumped out at me were some missing periods in couple of extra_scenery messages (the rotating-message thing was a nice trick, though).

When I was stuck in the midgame, my enthusiasm for the game wasn't quite as high as pinback's. The automaton is well coded and was an ambitious achievement in such a short amount of time, but the combination of being stuck and having sparse descriptions (if any) made me feel a bit like I was trapped in an old school adventure game lacking personality. (I figure the lack of descriptive text is a result of the burnout of coding the mechanics of the area)

Having beaten the game, in retrospect, the terseness is forgivable; I mean, you definitely want the player to concentrate on the puzzles at hand and not be distracted by the scenery. Still, I'd probably throw a description at the desk.

That all said, the ending, I thought, really brought it all together well and finished things on just the right note. All in all, this is a nice game that does "sinister" well (I expected it to let up at some point but was pleased that it didn't).

I'd say pinback's score is very much justified.

Party Arty, Man of La Munchies by Jonathan Blask-
This is a game that I meant to write for last year's New Year's comp, but I still wasn't that far into my Hugo learning yet so I didn't get to it. Overall, I'm pleased with the execution; I don't even feel bad that I didn't give the protagonist a description (or the snack table, I think). Still, if I add anything before I upload it, I think it might be a scoring system just to give victory a little more "oomph!". Also, maybe try to make the ending text funnier/more victorious.

Retro-Nemesis by Robb Sherwin-
Some of the playing-around-with-scenery or different-ways-to-respond could be tweaked here and there, but the story at its heart is pretty flawless. There were many lines that cracked me up, and it was a nice little journey. Plus, the music was nice, and it was cool that someone did multimedia for a little comp like this.

Spinning by Rob O’Hara-
Hugo is short on art-y games, so it is nice to see Flack adding to the ranks. For the time he spent learning Hugo and writing it, it's done quite well. I think, if taken to the game that it could be, it wouldn't end every descriptive text with the obvious command to go to the next scene, making the player resent being on rails so much. It's much better when we can trick the player into doing it or gently prod using daemons.

Still, for a guy just giving Hugo a quick visit, I wouldn't expect anything too complicated.

Tales of a Clockwork Boy by Marius Müller-
Here is another game by someone testing Hugo's waters. Marius is a tried-and-true I7 author, but he finally relented to my badgering and gave Hugo a try (he thought all programming was beyond him; I thought he just needed the right intro). I helped him with some of the programming aspects of the game but none of the design.

What resulted is a cute little fantasy that, for whatever reason, reminds me of games like Forbidden Castle. It's a bit tough on finding-correct-verbs and stuff, but the fantasy tropes that are there are bursting with personality. Commands aside, the puzzles are fun. It will be a nice little game for everyone who stumbles across it in the future.

World Builder by Paul Lee-
This is the kind of sci-fi game that writes sci-fi well enough to make me go, man, I could not write sci-fi. Earlier in this thread and in a message to Paul, I mentioned some of my problems with it (like knowing that your ship has targeting capabilities) or the fact that lots of words in the text should be added to extra_scenery so we get a "You don't need to refer to that." response.

All in all, though, it's a cool sci fi story and shows the kind of imagination we might expect from Paul in the future.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that it was also an especially nice example of having-a-character-named-Hugor.

Also:

Teleporter Test by Paul Robinson-
I found the wrench. I opened a grate. I haven't found anything else yet.

GENERAL GAME TWEAK SUGGESTIONS
I noticed a lot of scoreless games starting off with "0/0" in their status lines. If you don't have a score, set your STATUSTYPE global to 0 in the init routine. Otherwise, if you want something there that shows the number of moves, replace PrintStatusLine with something that only prints moves there.

Also, add the line:
display.title_caption = "<GAME>"
To the init routine. Then, in the official Hugo interpreter (or Hugor), the game window will be labeled your game, not the game file.

Those two things bug me!

FINAL THOUGHTS
Whoa, what a strong batch of games! This Hugo Comp has been a phenomenal success. It definitely surpassed my expectations. Kent Tessman himself said last night, "I've got to find some more time to actually sit down with these games. Because just on quick survey it's kinda fucking awesome."
Last edited by Roody_Yogurt on Thu Jan 05, 2012 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bainespal
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Post by Bainespal »

Roody_Yogurt wrote:Still, if I add anything before I upload it, I think it might be a scoring system just to give victory a little more "oomph!".
I agree. A scoring system that hands out a new rank every time the player scores could contribute much to the parody, especially if the rank titles are really funny/appropriate to the parody of Arthur. I think whatever makes the player think of classic IF could potentially enhance "Party Arty".
Roody_Yogurt wrote:I noticed a lot of scoreless games starting off with "0/0" in their status lines. If you don't have a score, set your STATUSTYPE global to 0 in the init routine.
I thought that would make the whole status line disappear. If it only makes the score and moves disappear but leaves the location, then that's just what I want.
Roody_Yogurt wrote:Also, add the line:
display.title_caption = "<GAME>"
To the init routine. Then, in the official Hugo interpreter (or Hugor), the game window will be labeled your game, not the game file.
Thanks for the reminder. I read about that variable in the Hugo Book a long time ago.

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Post by Roody_Yogurt »

Bainespal wrote: I thought that would make the whole status line disappear. If it only makes the score and moves disappear but leaves the location, then that's just what I want.
Yeah, it leaves the location name.

Taleslinger

Post by Taleslinger »

Here are my two cents about the games:

HUGO CLOCK

This one is competently coded, which is quite impressive for the short time alloted. Personally, I couldn't get into it at all, because I was put off the the sparse descriptions and the obvious puzzleness. I realize that this is purely a personal thing. You should definetely check it out.

TALES OF A CLOCKWORK BOY

What a useless piece of shit.

PARTY ARTY, MAN OF LA MUNCHIES by Jonathan Blask

This one is very funny, with that sparse Speed-IF feeling to it. I didn't play the game this references, but I liked the idea with the special powers and all that. I hope Roody gets back to it and fleshes it out some more; It has some comedic potential.


RETRO NEMESIS by Robb Sherwin

In a certain way, this game is a prime example of Robb's games and what's good and bad about them.

The music is cool. The writing is side-splittingly funny. There is this very odd, odd thing about his jokes where you really, really feel like you should be offended, but somehow aren't.

That said, Robb seems never much concerned with thorough implementation. But with a first command like this, it's hard to be angry at the game.

SPINNING by Rob O'Hara

A short story disguised as an IF game. It's always clear what to type next. Still, even this little interactivity gave me the feeling of being much more connected to the story than a static story might have.

WORLD BUILDER

A good sci-fi game with funny and fast-paced game play. There is a certain lock of implementation that is to be expected from a Speed IF. The story wasn't exactly to my tastes, but it was short and gripping enough that I enjoyed it immensely.

All in All, I had a really fun evening with the game. It's nice that Hugo himself took note of the games. I'm looking forward to what he has to say.

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Post by Tdarcos »

Bainespal wrote:I was kind of reluctant to allow "warp" as a synonym at this point, since my game isn't Star Trek, but I finally got over my reservation after the comp was delayed, because it really is a reasonable verb for players to guess, since most people are familiar enough with Trekky lingo.
You can use Warp, Starship Troopers which was released by Touchstone/Buena Vista (Disney's outlet for R rated films), used it to refer to a faster-than-light drive, so it's not exclusively Star Trek (Paramount Pictures).
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Post by Ice Cream Jonsey »

Taleslinger wrote:That said, Robb seems never much concerned with thorough implementation. But with a first command like this, it's hard to be angry at the game.
Oh no! What did you try that didn't work? I thought I accounted for everything.
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Post by Flack »

I'll bet you didn't account for Pinback disqualifying our games.
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Roody_Yogurt
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Post by Roody_Yogurt »

So, I was trying to lead by example and having my game all polished and ready for final release by the end of the weekend, but I got sidetracked by polishing up a new menu replacement extension I want to release into the wild instead.

Ideally, I'd like to set a final date for updates- mainly to make it happen sooner than later- so we can upload files to the IF Archive and make ifdb pages in style. It'd be great if we could do it this week, so that when they play our games at ClubFloyd next Sunday, they are using everyone's latest version.

Personally, I could have mine ready by Wednesday, but if we want to push it back to Friday, that'd be fine, too.

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Post by Bainespal »

Roody_Yogurt wrote:Ideally, I'd like to set a final date for updates- mainly to make it happen sooner than later- so we can upload files to the IF Archive and make ifdb pages in style. It'd be great if we could do it this week, so that when they play our games at ClubFloyd next Sunday, they are using everyone's latest version.

Personally, I could have mine ready by Wednesday, but if we want to push it back to Friday, that'd be fine, too.
I've been expecting to release an update soon, and I can probably get it done by Wednesday.

I actually already implemented the two main changes -- a replacement of the Library's DoTalk routine and an addition a short description that now provides some detail for the inside of the star cruiser and mentions its targeting/navigation systems. I still need to make sure my changes work, and from thinking about the code, I realized there's probably a major bug near the end that I should eliminate.

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Post by loafingcoyote »

Hello everyone. Here are my belated thoughts on the Hugo Comp extravaganza.


Tales of a Clockwork Boy

I would love to have many games similar to this one for my son when he's old enough to start IF. Simple puzzles, reasonably well written(especially for a non-English speaker) and short. The setting is nice and really only needs to be fleshed out with scenery and extra_words.

I got stuck at the golem, like everyone else, but this puzzle could be hinted at easily with a little word play. For example, The golem could tell the player he's fishing for sole fish and perhaps he could mention at some point eating filet of sole and that he's a heel at fishing(I apologize for the puns).

I enjoyed being able to open and close the portal. It made me laugh.


World Builder
For some reason, I thought this was going to be a one room game. I don't know how I got that impression. I've always wanted to do one myself but, as I've found, it's difficult to do well. I was amazed when the game opened up and just kept going. I kept saying to myself "Your kidding, there's more?" This game is actually small but feels like a grand adventure. This is a credit to the author.

I'm somewhat familiar with contemporary science fiction and I must say that this story is pretty unique; I've never seen anything quite like it.


Spinning

This has some strong writing and I love the way one scene transitions to the other.

Given how easy it was to find the word or phrase to make that transition, it made me think that this game could have been done using a one word parser. I'm sure the idea has been floated out there before and someone has probably even done it. I wouldn't know; I just think it's an interesting idea.

I was hoping it would follow a non-linear story line similar to Photopia. In a way it was non-linear since the entire thing was a flashback.

Overall, I would say this was implemented well and is a nice addition to the comp.


Party Arty, Man of La Munchies

I laughed out loud several times playing this. This is a great example of the gonzo humor that IF does so well. Some of my favorite IF games, the ones I enjoyed the most, are of this type(I had more fun playing Sins Against Mimesis than almost anything else I can remember).

The powers are great and illustrate perfectly the creative potential of IF. Thoroughly enjoyable!


Retro-Nemesis

I don't pretend to understand the story behind this. The writing is dense and complex and fantastic. The music compliments the experience perfectly and was a revelation. I had never played IF with sound and music before now and honestly didn't think it would work. I don't know why, since it is often what makes graphical adventures worth playing in the first place.

This work feels like a grainy independent movie, without a set script, where the camera found its way into the hands of the hair dresser. He shoots a bunch of stuff seemingly at random and the effect is mind blowing!

In the distant past, A Crimson Spring was the last game of Sherwin's that I played(forgive me, I've been gone awhile). I promise, with a solemn oath, to play his more recent games immediately!


Teleport Test

I was pleasantly surprised when I discovered that this was an actual game as opposed to merely a demonstration.

My favorite part was when I threw the breaker in the control center. It was quiet in my house and I unwittingly had the sound turned all the way up. I nearly jumped out of my chair.

Then something amazing happened. I went north to where the gas meter was. It was hissing, since I had hit it with the hammer. The lights were out and I only knew where I was because of the hiss of escaping gas. Now here is the remarkable part; I was momentarily disoriented. I didn't feel like I had just read it on a screen but that I had just stumbled into a dark room with a dangerous gas leak. This is the ultimate in IF immersion for me and was totally unexpected from this game.

For the second time in one night, sound effects transformed my IF experience.


Hugo Clock

this was my game so I won't say much. Only that I love immediate feedback and appreciate the constructive criticism. Thanks!

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Post by Roody_Yogurt »

re: Spinning

Huh, a 1-word-parser game isn't something I'd naturally think I'd enjoy, but yeah, I can see what you are saying. I probably would be more receptive to the idea if it was sold to me as a gimmick, and you're right- it'd lend itself well to this kind of game.

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Post by Bainespal »

loafingcoyote wrote:I'm somewhat familiar with contemporary science fiction and I must say that this story is pretty unique; I've never seen anything quite like it.
There's nothing very original to me in either the story or the setting. Rather, it's just my personal combination of great sources of inspiration. I am honored that you saw something unique in my little thrown-together game! Thanks. :)

That's not to dispute your familiarity with contemporary science fiction. Uniqueness is probably different than originality, but I think the credit for any uniqueness World Builder may have belongs to its inspirations. It's hard for me to say exactly where all the inspirations for the setting originated, but I know I got it from different science fiction shows, fantasy novels, etc. For the story, the only inspiration I was aware of while writing (there could have been others that affected me subconsciously) was the Bible -- death and resurrection, sundering and restoration, etc. Maybe Beowulf, too (the heroic action scenes and the occasional alliteration).

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Post by Tdarcos »

loafingcoyote wrote:Teleport Test

I was pleasantly surprised when I discovered that this was an actual game as opposed to merely a demonstration.
Yeah, when I was doing it, I thought, why not make it a real game? Put in a couple of puzzles and thus it actually works as more than just a demonstration of something I invented. (To my knowledge, nobody had ever done a game with a 'teleport to any room in the game' because in some games it wouldn't work, it would break the game because there are some places you shouldn't get to unless you've solved some of the puzzles.)

So I thought, how do I do that, and I added the return teleporter room, but it's flooded, so you have to stop the water and drain the room.
My favorite part was when I threw the breaker in the control center. It was quiet in my house and I unwittingly had the sound turned all the way up. I nearly jumped out of my chair.
Now you know exactly what I mean when I refer in the game to 'the sickening sound of a building shutting down'. If you've been in a nice warm house in winter, or a cool house in summer, with the central air running either for heat or a/c, and because something unexpected happens, like someone hits a pole, or the power company has such a high demand that something fails, or a tree falls down and cuts off power, and then you hear that sound, that potentially means you're either going to freeze or be very uncomfortable. Of course it could also happen because you didn't pay the bill, but then you should be expecting the power to be cut off.
Then something amazing happened. I went north to where the gas meter was. It was hissing, since I had hit it with the hammer. The lights were out and I only knew where I was because of the hiss of escaping gas. Now here is the remarkable part; I was momentarily disoriented. I didn't feel like I had just read it on a screen but that I had just stumbled into a dark room with a dangerous gas leak. This is the ultimate in IF immersion for me and was totally unexpected from this game.

For the second time in one night, sound effects transformed my IF experience.
The cute trick I did was to limit the gas leak sound to the viscinity of the leak, when you went out of range the hiss stops.

I'm glad the sound worked for you; for some reason it stopped working for me.

Also, a neat trick I put in was that the meters for gas and electric, because they're keeping the place comfortable, are running the whole time you move around. And if you break the gas meter, it now uses even more gas! The only thing I didn't do was have it check if the gas level was too high and either make the area sickening/lethal or cause it to become inflammable and explode from a spark. That was a little too much work for a short demonstration game.
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