Things That Don't Suck About A Macbook

by **Flack** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:29 pm

I spent all day working with a guy from Microsoft who is running Windows 8 and I was surprised to see how similar it's taskbar/dock is to the OSX screen shot you posted.

Given the same hardware, apparently Windows 8 runs faster than Windows 7. Also, that goofy "big blocks view" that every Windows 8 screen shot seems to reference ... I only saw that once on the guy's desktop I was working with today, and that was when he said, "hey, look at this stupid thing," and showed it to me. Other than the fact that they're removed the "start" button, it's surprisingly similar to Windows 7.

Also got to play with "core server" today, which is just a Windows server with the GUI removed. So it's kind of like Linux, except less free.

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:02 pm

It took a long time to realize this. Keep in mind that when I say this, I am criticizing myself. MYSELF. But not knowing basic Unix for the longest time made me an idiot. I am now less so.

I wish I could memorize more.

by **pinback** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 5:38 pm

bruce wrote:Oh, fuck it. Here's the ONLY REASON YOU EVER NEED that OS X is much, much better than Windows:

The userland is fucking BSD Unix.

There, that's it. That's all. You open up Terminal and, look, it's an actual shell. And you can do all the actual shell things in it. And you have Perl and Python right there, and all the regular Unix textutils.

Of course, if you're a mouth-breathing idiot who is afraid of command lines and man pages, then fuck you.

Bruce

That part is much much better than Windows, sure. But install Cygwin, and then the "much, much" part gets ripped out instantly, and in some cases, so does the "better" part.

by **bruce** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:37 pm

Oh, fuck it. Here's the ONLY REASON YOU EVER NEED that OS X is much, much better than Windows:

The userland is fucking BSD Unix.

There, that's it. That's all. You open up Terminal and, look, it's an actual shell. And you can do all the actual shell things in it. And you have Perl and Python right there, and all the regular Unix textutils.

Of course, if you're a mouth-breathing idiot who is afraid of command lines and man pages, then fuck you.

Bruce

by **Flack** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:47 pm

I haven't used a Mac since they had black and white displays so I have nothing to add there. However, I do know that there are lots and lots of free "virtual workspace" apps for Windows (VirtuaWin is one). If you're a Linux guy who likes that feature, there are plenty of free solutions available.

by **Ben's cyborg lazer eyes** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:24 pm

RetroRomper wrote:You implied that your favorite feature (and why you continue to stick with OS X and pay Apple's hardware premium) is a generic OS component that has been available in every OS that isn't Windows, since 2000 (even Haiku OS has a virtual workspace manager).

It's my favorite feature of OS X, but why I continue to pay Apple's hardware premium is, as mentioned before, the lack of software/hardware configuration & conflict hassles that plagued my Win-only days, and which were even a greater nightmare the few times I tried Linux (though those issues have been fewer with Vista and 7, and I understand they're less an issue with recent Linux flavors as well).

This thread started off with Ben talking about his unhappiness with having to use a Mac/OS X at work, and that he prefers to just toggle back to Windows, so that's the context I was speaking of - OS X in comparison with Windows. In that context, it's worth noting how OS X Spaces are useful, and how after using them, their lack is felt in Windows.

by **RetroRomper** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:38 pm

You implied that your favorite feature (and why you continue to stick with OS X and pay Apple's hardware premium) is a generic OS component that has been available in every OS that isn't Windows, since 2000 (even Haiku OS has a virtual workspace manager).

And no, it isn't present in Windows 7 - I still mock Microsoft occasionally for touting cascading windows as a "feature." It also doesn't appear that Windows 8 will have it (at least not in the preview I'm running), though I'd appreciate being shown otherwise.

by **Ben's spectacles** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:30 pm

Could... Could we not talk about "spaces" as if its a super secret Mac OS X feature? Christ, I've been running multiple work environments (in 3D no less) under Linux since... 2000? 2002? I don't even remember when it became standard, but saying that this generic feature is why you enjoy an OS is at this point, akin to saying that you prefer Pepsi because its carbonated.

I didn't claim it was invented in OS X, but I WAS comparing OS X to Windows. In Windows, it has certainly not been a built-in option until, perhaps 7 (again, not sure if it *is* really available in 7, but I know 7 offers several UI improvements I haven't dug into yet.)

by **RetroRomper** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:13 pm

The quick start bar, combines quick menu access to activate programs and indicators for various things (including if a program is running). In both theory and practice it works and at times, I've even used a program for Windows that duplicates the effects since it does work so well.

Ben has glasses LOL!!! wrote:Oh, and the thing I *like* the most about OS X is Spaces - which allows you to have multiple virtual desktops you can switch between.

Could... Could we not talk about "spaces" as if its a super secret Mac OS X feature? Christ, I've been running multiple work environments (in 3D no less) under Linux since... 2000? 2002? I don't even remember when it became standard, but saying that this generic feature is why you enjoy an OS is at this point, akin to saying that you prefer Pepsi because its carbonated.

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:04 pm

AArdvark wrote:Why not simply NOT show the application icons that aren't running? I have never used a mac so maybe I don't get this.

Because the UI to this thing was finished 20 years ago, but pieces of shit that design these sorts of UI still have to justify a paycheck.

by **AArdvark** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:56 pm

Why not simply NOT show the application icons that aren't running? I have never used a mac so maybe I don't get this.

THE
I LIKE BUTTONS
AARDVARK

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:52 pm

I think the other question is: should Ben burn his company to the ground for this insult?

by **Ben has glasses LOL!!!** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:41 pm

Oh, and the thing I *like* the most about OS X is Spaces - which allows you to have multiple virtual desktops you can switch between. I always clutter the hell out of whatever screen I'm using, so this is a sanity-saver for me, to have multiple programming windows open on one desktop, browser crap in another, gaming stuff on a third, music stuff on a fourth, etc. I currently go a bit bonkers when on Windows and not having that ability, though I think Win 7 might have version of it I haven't tried?

Anyway, pinback, try out Spaces and see if that assuages any OS X-unhappiness:

Using Spaces in OS X Lion

Spaces in previous OS X's

by **Ben is Buhlinde** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:24 pm

pinback wrote: Also, I should add that the mac user who told me that you can tell if it's running by whether you can quit it or not? This is someone who'd been using macs for YEARS. YEARS! So maybe "me being blind" is not the most ACCURATE description of why nobody knows about the goddamn white markers (which are much less apparent in the version of OSX I'm running than the screenshot you provided.)

Hm, all I can say is, that's the first time I've heard of a long-time OS X-user having that confusion, having worked with and known many other OS X-users.

The fn & cntrl keys -- that throws me off whenever immediately switching from Windows to OS X and vice-versa, but only for the first moment of the switch.

Overall, OS X is a much smoother experience for me than my still current travels in Windows Vista and Windows 7-land. The main thing has been immensely fewer hardware/software configuration issues than my past and current Win machines, which has more to do with Apple controlling (and thus syncing) both OS and hardware than anything else.

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:21 pm

Oh, I also forgot. There is a text subtitution to add "LOL!" to anytime someone says L-y-s-a-n-d-e-r is blind, but without the hyphens.

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:21 pm

Pinback is blind lol!!

(For our new poster, there is a running gag where we type "Lysander is blind LOL!! lol!" because Lysander is blind LOL!!. LOL!)

(Unless you are an old poster posing as a new one, in which case never mind.)

by **pinback** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:11 pm

pinback wrote:To: Ben is Blind

AHHAhahah, FUCK YOU, you idiot. WHITE MARKERS!! WHITE MARKERS!! Know what those white markers are if you're not aware they exist and aren't specifically looking for them? VIRTUALLY FUCKING INVISIBLE!

I see 'em now, though. That's helpful. Thank you. Asshole.

Also, I should add that the mac user who told me that you can tell if it's running by whether you can quit it or not? This is someone who'd been using macs for YEARS. YEARS! So maybe "me being blind" is not the most ACCURATE description of why nobody knows about the goddamn white markers (which are much less apparent in the version of OSX I'm running than the screenshot you provided.)

by **Ben is Blynde** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:10 pm

pinback wrote:To: Ben is Blind

AHHAhahah, FUCK YOU, you idiot. WHITE MARKERS!! WHITE MARKERS!! Know what those white markers are if you're not aware they exist and aren't specifically looking for them? VIRTUALLY FUCKING INVISIBLE!

I see 'em now, though. That's helpful. Thank you. Asshole.

You're welcome. I'm more concerned that your co-worker has apparently been using Macs for awhile and didn't know that. I agree that the markers are small and that a more obvious indicator (like what the mod RetroRomper suggested provides) would be a big improvement. BUT, it is something hard not to notice if you've used OS X for awhile, so that co-worker.....er....

The thing I dislike the most about OS X is that while Finder does an awesome job of cataloging all your files in the background so that search results are provided quickly, when you actually DO a search, the default is to search filenames AND file contents. I am almost always searching for a filename, so I am always getting more results than I need as a default - reams of irrelevant results. You can click "search by filename" below the search input window *after* a search has started, or put "name:" in front of the search term to restrict it to filename, but why for the love of God is search by filename not the *default*.

by **pinback** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:08 pm

RetroRomper wrote:A mod available for the quick start bar, surrounds active applications with a soft maroon glow. The subtlety of the white markers, is one of the few usability issues I've seen clients have with Mac OS X.

How about the fact that you CAN'T TURN MOUSE ACCELERATION OFF without another "mod"?

How about the fact that you CAN'T SWITCH THE CTRL AND FN KEYS TO BE WHERE THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE FIRST PLACE without another "mod"?

I got this macbook in workable condition by spending the first three to four hours downloading "mods" to make it usable, and this seems to be the only defense these maclovers have to their godforsaken OS. "Oh, you can fix that with a mod!"

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 11:54 am

pinback wrote:To: Ben is Blind

AHHAhahah, FUCK YOU, you idiot. WHITE MARKERS!! WHITE MARKERS!! Know what those white markers are if you're not aware they exist and aren't specifically looking for them? VIRTUALLY FUCKING INVISIBLE!

I see 'em now, though. That's helpful. Thank you. Asshole.

I am glad we could all come together in friendship for this.

Things That Don't Suck About A Macbook

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