There is a difference between nouns and adjectives

by **Tdarcos** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:52 pm

Going back to the original explanation, here's an example:

object Ticket_Machine "ticket machine"
&#123;
	article "a"
	in Game_Exit
	is static 
	adjectives "ticket","machine"
&#125;

object exit_ticket "exit ticket"
&#123;
	article "an"
	noun "ticket"
	in Game_Exit
	adjective "exit"
&#125;

When within the room "game_exit", saying "examine ticket" or "x ticket" refers to the exit_ticket object, but saying "examine ticket machine" works correctly. So does "examine exit ticket".

by **Tdarcos** » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:15 am

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:
Tdarcos wrote:BZZZZT! Try again; we've only had fuse boxes since we had electricity thanks to the guy on the $100 bill, and we didn't even get it in our houses until delivering it became cheap enough around the early 20th century
Incorrect. At least no everywhere. In the midwest, due to the anticipation of electricity and electric grids, houses started to be made with circuit breakers IN ADVANCE of towns getting wired up as early as 1882.

I am surprised some people were actually thinking ahead.

Okay, still, granting your argument, Civilization has not collapsed since 1882.

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:13 pm

Tdarcos wrote:BZZZZT! Try again; we've only had fuse boxes since we had electricity thanks to the guy on the $100 bill, and we didn't even get it in our houses until delivering it became cheap enough around the early 20th century

Incorrect. At least no everywhere. In the midwest, due to the anticipation of electricity and electric grids, houses started to be made with circuit breakers IN ADVANCE of towns getting wired up as early as 1882.

by **TSummary** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:43 pm

Tdarcos wrote:
Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:Hey asshole, you can still edit your post BEFORE you hit "submit."
Takes one to know one. And sometimes I miss things. And it was a tangent "digressing suddenly from one course of action or thought and turning to another." I wasn't thinking, then I got thinking about it, then I remembered it wasn't really relevant to the topic, but then I realized I'd hit the submit button but it was too late.

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:What you wrote was the entirety of a Wikipedia entry for fuse boxes over the course of the rise and fall of several western civilizations.
BZZZZT! Try again; we've only had fuse boxes since we had electricity thanks to the guy on the $100 bill, and we didn't even get it in our houses until delivering it became cheap enough around the early 20th century, and even if we go back as far as old Ben's time, civilization hasn't fallen even once since then. Well, seeing some of the people who represent the finest examples of todays celebrities, some people might disagree, but...

TSUMMARY: "I'M BAAA-AAACK!"

by **Tdarcos** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:32 pm

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:Hey asshole, you can still edit your post BEFORE you hit "submit."

Takes one to know one. And sometimes I miss things. And it was a tangent "digressing suddenly from one course of action or thought and turning to another." I wasn't thinking, then I got thinking about it, then I remembered it wasn't really relevant to the topic, but then I realized I'd hit the submit button but it was too late.

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:What you wrote was the entirety of a Wikipedia entry for fuse boxes over the course of the rise and fall of several western civilizations.

BZZZZT! Try again; we've only had fuse boxes since we had electricity thanks to the guy on the $100 bill, and we didn't even get it in our houses until delivering it became cheap enough around the early 20th century, and even if we go back as far as old Ben's time, civilization hasn't fallen even once since then. Well, seeing some of the people who represent the finest examples of todays celebrities, some people might disagree, but...

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:50 am

Tdarcos wrote:
Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:Huh, just thought I'd read the old Hugo base, and -- and --

JESUS, MARY, MOTHER OF GOD -- NOBODY FUCKING GIVES A SHIT.
Sorry, I got caught on a tangent and as soon as I saved it I realized it was way too much. But, you've chosen to make it impossible for someone to revise their remarks, so you're stuck with the problem. Stop bitching about a problem you created. And don't try to weasel out by saying I created it; who threw the switch that locked the feature out?

Hey asshole, you can still edit your post BEFORE you hit "submit."

That is not a tangent. Here is a tangent:

"Anyone want a donut before the meeting? No? OK. Let's begin..."

What you wrote was the entirety of a Wikipedia entry for fuse boxes over the course of the rise and fall of several western civilizations.

What did you think would happen, Commander? WHAT DID YOU THINK would HAPPEN??!

by **pinback** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:13 am

Tdarcos wrote:
TSummary wrote:TSUMMARY: "Also I find different parts of speech like nouns and adverbs 'klugey'."
No, I find having to use both declaration a "kluge" and an unnecessary one, plus extra work, when one of the declarations works for what I need to do. Learn to read, sometime.

Awwww shit!

by **Tdarcos** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:47 am

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:Huh, just thought I'd read the old Hugo base, and -- and --

JESUS, MARY, MOTHER OF GOD -- NOBODY FUCKING GIVES A SHIT.

Sorry, I got caught on a tangent and as soon as I saved it I realized it was way too much. But, you've chosen to make it impossible for someone to revise their remarks, so you're stuck with the problem. Stop bitching about a problem you created. And don't try to weasel out by saying I created it; who threw the switch that locked the feature out?

by **Tdarcos** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:44 am

TSummary wrote:TSUMMARY: "Also I find different parts of speech like nouns and adverbs 'klugey'."

No, I find having to use both declaration a "kluge" and an unnecessary one, plus extra work, when one of the declarations works for what I need to do. Learn to read, sometime.

by **TSummary** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:06 am

Tdarcos wrote:I'm calling it a fuse box because that's colloquial. I happen to have one in my room, it's the primary box for the house. Open the fuse box and it's full of...

breakers. There are no fuses at all.

But what do people normally say when they need to disconnect something? "Don't work on the electric range until I shut it off at the fuse box," or do they say "Don't work on the electric range until I shut it off at the breaker box." ? Most likely, the former even though nobody's had a fuse box in 40 years unless they have an old, old place and no one ever bothered to upgrade.

If you figure a <s>fuse </s> breaker box costs maybe $100 and if you hire an electrician to replace the fusebox with a breaker box about another $200, over the IRS projected lifespan of a house it's about $10 a year; if we take it over the average time someone lives in a house, 6-8 years, it's about $50 a year and once it's done it requires no maintenance.

I mean, this house I live in was built in 1949 (I did due dilligence to make sure the guy I was renting a room from actually was the owner), and I'm sure when it was built it used fuses, but the disconnect box consists of breakers. It's much more convenient and potentially less expensive; if you overload a circuit, instead of blowing a 90c fuse, it trips a breaker to the 1/2 way point (that way you know a circuit is off because the breaker overload tripped as opposed to being off because someone turned it off.) You throw the switch to off to release the trip, then, if you've removed the overload, throw the switch to on. If you messed up, and didn't fix it, in a fuse box you blow it the instant you restore power to the circuit; in a breaker, if you try to turn it on and it's still overloaded it simply pops back to the middle trip position.

No more spending money every time you overload a circuit and no more running out of fuses ala Ralphie's father in A Christmas Story who overloads the wiring in his house so much he keeps a fire extinguisher at the ready and buys fuses in wholesale quantities.

I looked it up at home depot, I estimated 90c; a pack of 4 fuses today sells for $6 to $11, which is $1.50 to $2.75 each. Cars still use fuses because for the environment they make sense, people don't blow them that often, they're not very expensive and they're about the size of a cap of a pen as opposed to something about the size of a quarter.

Have you encountered parse_rank yet, Commander? It is also helpful for determining what gets referred to first.
Fortunately not, I just pointed this out because I was doing "adverb" and found it works fine, but noun did not. I haven't been forced to use kluges like nouns and adverbs, the use of adverbs alone works okay. First rule, just get it to work okay.

I just want to write the adventure, I don't want to have to fight the compiler or find workarounds. I mean, the whole point of using an adventure writing tool is the same reason you use PHP rather than COBOL to implement web-page backends; it's a specialized tool that works better for the problem domain.

TSUMMARY: "Despite the fact that circuit panels replaced fuse boxes in new construction in the 1950s, some people still refer to circuit panels as fuse boxes. Also I find different parts of speech like nouns and adverbs 'klugey'."

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:36 pm

Huh, just thought I'd read the old Hugo base, and -- and --

But what do people normally say when they need to disconnect something? "Don't work on the electric range until I shut it off at the fuse box," or do they say "Don't work on the electric range until I shut it off at the breaker box." ? Most likely, the former even though nobody's had a fuse box in 40 years unless they have an old, old place and no one ever bothered to upgrade.

If you figure a <s>fuse </s> breaker box costs maybe $100 and if you hire an electrician to replace the fusebox with a breaker box about another $200, over the IRS projected lifespan of a house it's about $10 a year; if we take it over the average time someone lives in a house, 6-8 years, it's about $50 a year and once it's done it requires no maintenance.

I mean, this house I live in was built in 1949 (I did due dilligence to make sure the guy I was renting a room from actually was the owner), and I'm sure when it was built it used fuses, but the disconnect box consists of breakers. It's much more convenient and potentially less expensive; if you overload a circuit, instead of blowing a 90c fuse, it trips a breaker to the 1/2 way point (that way you know a circuit is off because the breaker overload tripped as opposed to being off because someone turned it off.) You throw the switch to off to release the trip, then, if you've removed the overload, throw the switch to on. If you messed up, and didn't fix it, in a fuse box you blow it the instant you restore power to the circuit; in a breaker, if you try to turn it on and it's still overloaded it simply pops back to the middle trip position.

No more spending money every time you overload a circuit and no more running out of fuses ala Ralphie's father in A Christmas Story who overloads the wiring in his house so much he keeps a fire extinguisher at the ready and buys fuses in wholesale quantities.

I looked it up at home depot, I estimated 90c; a pack of 4 fuses today sells for $6 to $11, which is $1.50 to $2.75 each. Cars still use fuses because for the environment they make sense, people don't blow them that often, they're not very expensive and they're about the size of a cap of a pen as opposed to something about the size of a quarter.

JESUS, MARY, MOTHER OF GOD -- NOBODY FUCKING GIVES A SHIT.

by **Tdarcos** » Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:42 pm

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:yeah, what you want to do is:

object fusebox "fuse box"
nouns "box" "fusebox"
adjectives "fuse"

And then if you had fuses

object fuse "fuse"
nouns "fuse"

If the fuse and fuse box are in the same room, that gives you the following:

- talking about "fuse" defaults to the object fuse's noun property

If the fuse is not in the room but the fuse box is, you can reference the fuse box with the word fuse.

I'm calling it a fuse box because that's colloquial. I happen to have one in my room, it's the primary box for the house. Open the fuse box and it's full of...

breakers. There are no fuses at all.

But what do people normally say when they need to disconnect something? "Don't work on the electric range until I shut it off at the fuse box," or do they say "Don't work on the electric range until I shut it off at the breaker box." ? Most likely, the former even though nobody's had a fuse box in 40 years unless they have an old, old place and no one ever bothered to upgrade.

If you figure a <s>fuse </s> breaker box costs maybe $100 and if you hire an electrician to replace the fusebox with a breaker box about another $200, over the IRS projected lifespan of a house it's about $10 a year; if we take it over the average time someone lives in a house, 6-8 years, it's about $50 a year and once it's done it requires no maintenance.

I mean, this house I live in was built in 1949 (I did due dilligence to make sure the guy I was renting a room from actually was the owner), and I'm sure when it was built it used fuses, but the disconnect box consists of breakers. It's much more convenient and potentially less expensive; if you overload a circuit, instead of blowing a 90c fuse, it trips a breaker to the 1/2 way point (that way you know a circuit is off because the breaker overload tripped as opposed to being off because someone turned it off.) You throw the switch to off to release the trip, then, if you've removed the overload, throw the switch to on. If you messed up, and didn't fix it, in a fuse box you blow it the instant you restore power to the circuit; in a breaker, if you try to turn it on and it's still overloaded it simply pops back to the middle trip position.

No more spending money every time you overload a circuit and no more running out of fuses ala Ralphie's father in A Christmas Story who overloads the wiring in his house so much he keeps a fire extinguisher at the ready and buys fuses in wholesale quantities.

I looked it up at home depot, I estimated 90c; a pack of 4 fuses today sells for $6 to $11, which is $1.50 to $2.75 each. Cars still use fuses because for the environment they make sense, people don't blow them that often, they're not very expensive and they're about the size of a cap of a pen as opposed to something about the size of a quarter.

Have you encountered parse_rank yet, Commander? It is also helpful for determining what gets referred to first.

Fortunately not, I just pointed this out because I was doing "adverb" and found it works fine, but noun did not. I haven't been forced to use kluges like nouns and adverbs, the use of adverbs alone works okay. First rule, just get it to work okay.

I just want to write the adventure, I don't want to have to fight the compiler or find workarounds. I mean, the whole point of using an adventure writing tool is the same reason you use PHP rather than COBOL to implement web-page backends; it's a specialized tool that works better for the problem domain.

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:22 pm

yeah, what you want to do is:

object fusebox "fuse box"
nouns "box" "fusebox"
adjectives "fuse"

And then if you had fuses

object fuse "fuse"
nouns "fuse"

If the fuse and fuse box are in the same room, that gives you the following:

- talking about "fuse" defaults to the object fuse's noun property

If the fuse is not in the room but the fuse box is, you can reference the fuse box with the word fuse.

Have you encountered parse_rank yet, Commander? It is also helpful for determining what gets referred to first.

by **Roody_Yogurt** » Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:14 pm

Well, you're not supposed to use only one or the other. Try adding a fuse that can be put inside your fuse boxes and see how it works with both of those cases.

by **Tdarcos** » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:58 pm

Here's something I found by accident, a reason for using adjectives over nouns:

Code: Select all

object fusebox1 "fuse box"
&#123;
	in meter_room
	article "a"
	adjectives "fuse","box","breaker"
	is static, openable
&#125;

object fusebox2 "fuse box"
&#123;
	in closet
	article "a"
	nouns "fuse","box","breaker"
	is static, openable
&#125;

Now, remember, there is a noun "fuse box" in the closet, an adjective "fuse box" in the meter_room. Notice how the game treats them.

Transcript
You're in the control center
You are in the main control center. You can go in any of the twelve directions from here.

>n

You're in the closet next to the control center
The only place you can go is OUT to the control center.
A fuse box is here.

>open fuse box
You haven't encountered any "fuse box". (If you're sure you need to refer to that, try putting it another way.)

>out

You're in the control center

>e

You are in the Meter Room of the control center
You are in the meter room of the control center. Nailed to a table is a yardstick. Oh. Excuse me, it's 39 inches long. It's a meter stick. Of course, how
stupid of me! You can go OUT to return to the control center.
A gas meter, an electric meter, a water meter, and a fuse box are here.

>open fuse box
Opened.

>close fuse box
Closed.

>open box
Opened.

>close fuse
Closed.

>out

You're in the control center

>n

You're in the closet next to the control center
A fuse box is here.

>open fuse box
You haven't encountered any "fuse box". (If you're sure you need to refer to that, try putting it another way.)

>open fuse
Opened.

>close box
Closed.

Adjective allows both terms for a more "natural" communication with the game, noun doesn't. (Which do you think is more likely, people will say "open box" or "open fuse box"?) Discovered this behavior completely by accident then added a second fuse box to confirm it.

There is a difference between nouns and adjectives

Post a reply

Expand view Topic review: There is a difference between nouns and adjectives

There is a difference between nouns and adjectives