pinback wrote:The game is not about robotic dinosaurs. Christ. 90% of it is about shooting Nazis in the face. 8% is about a boss or two. The remaining 2% features robotic "dinosaurs"/dogs/etc.

Bah. That doesn't say much. You can prove anything with facts.

pinback wrote:

Come now all you denizens of Jolt Country. I can't be alone in this opinion.

You are, and will continue to be. My suggestion is, "play" the "actual" "game" and realize how bad your opinions are.

That actually wouldn't surprise me considering the high probability that all those "others" who are conveniently silent right now are probably just alter-egos of you and the two Robs. :P

Garth's Equipment Shop wrote:I was writing my opinion of what I saw in the promo video from the point of view of a long time Wolfenstein fan. From what ICJ wrote of his first hand experience with the game it sounds like a good game in spite of my aesthetic criticisms. I just hate it when commercial game companies take a well established and beloved game world or mythos and take extreme liberties with it with no respect for the gradual evolution of the series that preceded it.

What about if it does that but in doing that makes it WAY, WAY BETTER?

Matter's Return to Castle Wolfenstein. Honestly though, do you really think those past leaps justify the leap from armies of darkness summoned up from the abyss by a secret society of nazi occultists to robotic dinosaurs?

The game is not about robotic dinosaurs. Christ. 90% of it is about shooting Nazis in the face. 8% is about a boss or two. The remaining 2% features robotic "dinosaurs"/dogs/etc.

Come now all you denizens of Jolt Country. I can't be alone in this opinion.

You are, and will continue to be. My suggestion is, "play" the "actual" "game" and realize how bad your opinions are.

I was writing my opinion of what I saw in the promo video from the point of view of a long time Wolfenstein fan. From what ICJ wrote of his first hand experience with the game it sounds like a good game in spite of my aesthetic criticisms. I just hate it when commercial game companies take a well established and beloved game world or mythos and take extreme liberties with it with no respect for the gradual evolution of the series that preceded it.

Ok ok, gradual evolution is an absurd way of describing the leaps from the two color line art of Muse's Castle Wolfenstein to John Romero's Wolfenstein 3d to Gray Matter's Return to Castle Wolfenstein. Honestly though, do you really think those past leaps justify the leap from armies of darkness summoned up from the abyss by a secret society of nazi occultists to robotic dinosaurs?

Come now all you denizens of Jolt Country. I can't be alone in this opinion. Don't be intimidated by their admin or mod status, you should know by now that means squat around here. Speak up, voice your real opinion people!

Garth's Equipment Shop wrote: I should clarify that my comments were based entirely on that one video at the official game site which seems to consist of only the opening intro movie or game trailer.

Wait a minute, you've written four critical posts about a game that you've only seen the TRAILER for? Even when critics and actual players alike have told you how great it is?

It was a BAD CALL, Ripley. It was a BAD CALL.

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:Er, well, we employed (and naturalized) German scientists before and during the war. But they weren't Nazis.

I am unaware of any real advances or information coming from Mengele and so forth.

Right, real scientists are objective and have more interest in scientific discovery and advances than in politics. Which is why they will salute whatever regime happens to hold the reins of power in order to continue in their pursuit of scientific knowledge and why they end up building weapons and such for whichever military organization funds their research. So while they were under Third Reich authority they pursued science the only way they could, by researching whatever the NSDAP wanted them to. And after they were gone, they researched whatever their new employers wanted them to which often times happened to be the same things (rocket science, nukes, experimental methods of mind control, mass psychology for the purposes of swaying public opinion, etc.).

pinback wrote:

Garth's Equipment Shop wrote:Don't like the new music either, reminds me of an amusement park ride, and I don't mean the scarey kind.

Wow, you packed a lot of really bad opinions into these two posts, but they all pale in comparison to this one. The music is PHENOMENAL, second best music in any game in history (behind Braid, of course), and I don't just mean the song from the Meshuggah guy.

I should clarify that my comments were based entirely on that one video at the official game site which seems to consist of only the opening intro movie or game trailer. So I didn't hear any music other than that weak attempt at an authentic sounding nazi war song. I loved how the music of Return to Castle Wolfenstein reminded me of classic WWII war flicks. I didn't hear any Meshuggah, but I wouldn't have found that fitting music either unless they completely changed their style for the game. Their usual style simply doesnt fit. I'm pretty old school when it comes to metal. Can't get into Meshuggah or most of the newer stuff that came after the era that to me is best symbolized by Maiden.

Garth's Equipment Shop wrote:In real history the U.S. gov grabbed nazi scientists after the combined might of the allies defeated Germany. Wouldn't it be more accurate to say we took nazi knowledge and built on it?

Er, well, we employed (and naturalized) German scientists before and during the war. But they weren't Nazis.

I am unaware of any real advances or information coming from Mengele and so forth.

Is it better than SKYRIM?

No accounting for taste I guess. :)

Garth's Equipment Shop wrote:Don't like the new music either, reminds me of an amusement park ride, and I don't mean the scarey kind.

Wow, you packed a lot of really bad opinions into these two posts, but they all pale in comparison to this one. The music is PHENOMENAL, second best music in any game in history (behind Braid, of course), and I don't just mean the song from the Meshuggah guy.

pinback wrote:Have you gotten any further?

Have you gotten to the opening credits?

No, sir. I have not gotten further than where I was. My time to play computer games is sadly limited. Three day weekends are the most limited of all, ironically. :/

I need a job where they send me away for a week.

Considering how obsessed they were with genetics and all it would seem more in line with the nazi way to pull off some sort of Jurrasic Park thing if they had their minds on dinosaurs rather than the robotic kind. They were also into traveling around the world in search of ancient artifacts and archeology. So real history already provides a bridge for the Wolfenstein mythos like an Indiana Jones meets Jurassic Park. Instead of unearthing the Ark of the Covenant or Holy Grail they find some petrified tree sap with a mosquitto in it which they extract dinosaur dna from and nazi geneticists hatch their own army of raptors.

I liked the dark Cthulu and zombie apocalypse vibe of Return better. Don't like the new music either, reminds me of an amusement park ride, and I don't mean the scarey kind.

The dinosaur thing just seems to me like they are trying to appeal to much younger dinosaur obsessed audiences, smart move I guess from a marketing point of view but a huge leap away from established Wolfenstein mythology in my opinion.

Would be better if the nazis were left as they were at the end of Return, their secret weapons and plan for world domination destroyed, and turn the focus towards the Red menace which followed WWII. Plenty of evil and secrecy and mass murder and wacko science and cultism behind the old iron curtain of the totalitarian Soviet Union.

Also in the intro video I watched the narrator says the nazis stole their knowledge from the allies. Thats kind of pulling the rug out from under the whole evil master mind mythos of Wolfenstein nazis isn't it? In real history the U.S. gov grabbed nazi scientists after the combined might of the allies defeated Germany. Wouldn't it be more accurate to say we took nazi knowledge and built on it? Yeah I know its historical fiction and all but turning facts completely around and crediting one side of a conflict with the acts of the other side is not my idea of good historical fiction. Its not creative, its just plain lazy. And confusing.

Have you gotten any further?

Have you gotten to the opening credits?

Wolfenstein has more interesting ideas in the first 30 minutes than most first person shooters ever have. There is an "action movie" feel in this time, crossed with a disaster movie. Everything that can go wrong is going wrong, and B.J. has a genuinely fun companion in.... well, he's English, he wasn't QUITE so memorable that I remembered his name. But still. An English WWII pilot.

One of the really cool things from the get-go is the dinosaur-like mechanical creatures that attack the Allied forces when the airplanes are down. No offense to anyone who is German who might be reading this, but the craftsmanship of metal dinosaurs is something that I could totally see German engineers creating. I mean that in a good way! Dump a couple of them into a battlefield and let them rip troops into pieces. It's a great design.

More, while the game tries to introduce you to sprint-sliding by putting you almost face-to-jaws with one of the beasts -- some junk initially stands between you -- the hungry metal animal does not sit there and wait for you to figure out the controls. You're under pressure and will get torn to pieces if you don't figure them out quick enough. That successfully introduces the concept of SPEED and its critical nature into the game. It's a subtle touch but proves that this game is in good hands from the start.