On the "Groundhog Day" theory in fiction

by **Tdarcos** » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:09 am

Okay, let me try going a little deeper.

In Groundhog Day, when Bill Murray is killed or the time reaches 5:59:59 AM on February 3, the day resets back to 6:00 AM on February 2, Groundhog Day, and he wakes up to Sonny and Cher's "I got you babe."

In Edge of Tomorrow Tom Cruise is a soldier trying to stop an extraterrestrial invasion. Sometimes he gets killed fighting, sometimes one of the other people helping him kills him in order to reset the day again. He wakes up from sleeping on a pile of duffle bags. Also, the period from when he awakens until he is killed can exceed 24 hours.

In both films it does show that even when he dies, the day continues for everyone else, at least for a short while.

Therefore I was arguing for essentially two possible conclusions. (1) He dies, and is restarted into a parallel universe at the earlier time; (2) he is sent back to the same universe, just rolled back to the time he was before and thus, presumably he can't be in both places at the same time, the previous time-line is simply erased.

I thought this would be a fun scenario to look at.

Billy, can you perhaps simplify what your opinion was? I really didn't get it and I'd like to understand it.

by **Billy Mays** » Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:24 pm

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:
RetroRomper wrote:That you are a fount of energy that is reinvigorating this dreadful, dusty place?
THIS place is dreadful?

THIS place is dusty?

I am really enjoying my stay here at JC. Everywhere else on the internet you either have to mind your manors, or the people there are so degenerate that you don't really want to be there longer than you "have" to. ICJ somehow figured out a way of crafting a compromise between those two extremes....

by **Ice Cream Jonsey** » Sat Oct 01, 2016 10:40 pm

RetroRomper wrote:That you are a fount of energy that is reinvigorating this dreadful, dusty place?

THIS place is dreadful?

THIS place is dusty?

by **RetroRomper** » Sat Oct 01, 2016 10:32 pm

That you are a fount of energy that is reinvigorating this dreadful, dusty place?

by **Billy Mays** » Sat Oct 01, 2016 10:19 pm

RetroRomper wrote:The only thing that annoys me about Billy, is his (their? What pronoun would you prefer?) unprecedented (for this place) fount of energy.

As someone with major depressed, I'm not sure whether I'd like crack his skull upon and suck out the dopamine from his brain to absorb said energy, or continue to scowl at my screen.

Think I'll just go on scowling.

I'll let this one slide because I don't need it on my conscience, but you do not want to go down this road.

by **RetroRomper** » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:43 pm

The only thing that annoys me about Billy, is his (their? What pronoun would you prefer?) unprecedented (for this place) fount of energy.

As someone with major depressed, I'm not sure whether I'd like crack his skull upon and suck out the dopamine from his brain to absorb said energy, or continue to scowl at my screen.

Think I'll just go on scowling.

by **Didn't see this coming.** » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:16 pm

Tdarcos wrote:In the case of someone being stuck in a "Groundhog-Day" style loop, does the world continue when the person restarts only they jump to a parallel universe at the time that their day started, or does the world they were in end when they leave it?

Are you trying to discover a method of disrupting the space-time continuum so that you never feel the anguish of running out of peach cobbler ever again?

by **Billy Mays** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:20 pm

Billy Mays wrote:
pinback wrote:No you don't.

This is where I need to politely disagree with your assertion. To demonstrate my interest in this current topic, I have graphed out my belief on the Groundhog's Day hypothesis:

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazccccccccccccccccccccc...

t------------------------------------------------>

bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbzddddddddddddddddd...

where azc and bzd are two parallel timelines that mirror each other, and "t" represents time as a constant.

The subject in this scenario starts off on the "a" line with everything else in the world, and travels in time against his will until reaching "z" where an event occurs.

Now you see 3 parallel lines that run across the x-axis, what this graph does not easily represent is that "z" runs across the z-axis. Imagine this graph replicated an infinite amount of times in either direction along the z-axis, and instead of a "loop" at "z", you actually have a spiral at "z".

"x" is a completely unknown variable since it is outside the observation of the main subject. Did everyone else escape the escape the event? Did everything die? Did they all get thrown onto separate parts of the spiral? You can only speculate at this point, and the only thing that you know is that time has continued moving along the z-axis line for the man.

The fact that the subject travelling along the z-axis is the only one cognizant of the predicament he is in indicates that he is the only one traveling on the z-axis spiral, and that everyone else is traveling on an z-axis circles that mirror each other an infinite amount of times in either direction. There the subject is able to interact with the outside world when his spiral intercepts with those circles along the z- axis.

This is why he is not able to kill himself permanently: because factors that exist to harm him reside outside of the timeline that he is currently traveling on. Any "he kills himself and then wakes up to the alarm" scenes are merely his brain's attempt to connect the dots in a very unfamiliar environment.

What makes the man so unique is that he has the ability to travel time laterally upon realizing that a very important condition needs to be met first. At this point he is able to travel down to the "d" line and resume his existence from the mirrored "b" line, and live happily ever after.

I hardly believe any of this is possible, and breaks almost every known scientific law that exists, but this is my theory on the Groundhog's Day theory.

Great Post Tdarcos!!!

the "x" should be "c" in the explanation above, I changed the letters around a couple of times, and forgot to change this in the explanation. It is also important to emphasize that something is occurring in c, it is just occurring isolated from the man.

by **Billy Mays** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:14 pm

Tdarcos wrote:
So let me see if I understand you. Here is a summary of what I think you meant:

An interesting explanation of things from Tdarcos.

No.

by **Tdarcos** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:01 pm

Billy, after that post of yours I think I am contaminating you and turning you into a clone of me, and I kind of understand why people are complaining about my extremely long posts.

So let me see if I understand you. Here is a summary of what I think you meant:

In the case of the individual caught in a "Groundhog Day" loop, they are within an "A" universe, but at the point where they become part of the loop, they enter a separate "X" universe, which winds around and parallels the real universe "A", and when they die in "A", "X" winds their time back to the past in the "A" universe, meaning that in theory, the "A" universe could actually have gone on, as "A" does if he lives longer in one of the previous times where the "X" universe parallels or merges with "A", but that for him, when he dies in "A", the "X" universe he is in simply rolls his time back to the point in the "A" universe he started also occupying the "X" universe at the previous time, the winding being similar to a moebius[1] strip.

[1] The word "moebius" is supposed to have a diacritical mark but for some reason alternate characters cause the PhpBB software this board is running to blank out the post.

by **Jizaboz** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:45 pm

The first option is the only one that makes sense to me. Almost like "cloud computing". If the world exists in one cluster of servers.. the dude in Groundhog day for some reason lives in one server in that cluster that keeps being restored back to an image of the server of the previous morning.. OR, that "instance" is killed off and he's simply respawned into the a new "clone" of said instance.

by **Billy Mays** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:16 pm

pinback wrote:No you don't.

This is where I need to politely disagree with your assertion. To demonstrate my interest in this current topic, I have graphed out my belief on the Groundhog's Day hypothesis:

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazccccccccccccccccccccc...

t------------------------------------------------>

bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbzddddddddddddddddd...

where azc and bzd are two parallel timelines that mirror each other, and "t" represents time as a constant.

The subject in this scenario starts off on the "a" line with everything else in the world, and travels in time against his will until reaching "z" where an event occurs.

Now you see 3 parallel lines that run across the x-axis, what this graph does not easily represent is that "z" runs across the z-axis. Imagine this graph replicated an infinite amount of times in either direction along the z-axis, and instead of a "loop" at "z", you actually have a spiral at "z".

"x" is a completely unknown variable since it is outside the observation of the main subject. Did everyone else escape the escape the event? Did everything die? Did they all get thrown onto separate parts of the spiral? You can only speculate at this point, and the only thing that you know is that time has continued moving along the z-axis line for the man.

The fact that the subject travelling along the z-axis is the only one cognizant of the predicament he is in indicates that he is the only one traveling on the z-axis spiral, and that everyone else is traveling on an z-axis circles that mirror each other an infinite amount of times in either direction. There the subject is able to interact with the outside world when his spiral intercepts with those circles along the z- axis.

This is why he is not able to kill himself permanently: because factors that exist to harm him reside outside of the timeline that he is currently traveling on. Any "he kills himself and then wakes up to the alarm" scenes are merely his brain's attempt to connect the dots in a very unfamiliar environment.

What makes the man so unique is that he has the ability to travel time laterally upon realizing that a very important condition needs to be met first. At this point he is able to travel down to the "d" line and resume his existence from the mirrored "b" line, and live happily ever after.

I hardly believe any of this is possible, and breaks almost every known scientific law that exists, but this is my theory on the Groundhog's Day theory.

Great Post Tdarcos!!!

by **AArdvark** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:10 pm

polite conversation on a number of levels.

Glad that's not going to happen here.

So if G-Day is happening to person X then it also must also happen for everyone else, except that they wouldn't notice it. Is that the gist of the thought?

Never saw the Tom Cruise movie, hope it was good. Sounds like a take on The Forever War by Joe Haldeman.

THE
LATHER, RINSE, REPEAT
AARDVARK

by **pinback** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 11:14 am

No you don't.

by **Billy Mays** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 11:01 am

pinback wrote:Well, I assume it'd be different for every movie. Surely Groundhog Day rules are not the same as Edge of Tomorrow rules.

This poll is bogus and unacceptable.

I feel that what Tdarcos is bringing up here could provide immense amounts of value in polite conversation on a number of levels.

by **pinback** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:54 am

Well, I assume it'd be different for every movie. Surely Groundhog Day rules are not the same as Edge of Tomorrow rules.

This poll is bogus and unacceptable.

by **Tdarcos** » Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:09 pm

pinback wrote:You're asking if Groundhog Day actually happened, what would happen?

That's what you're asking a group of people over the age of six?

And you were doing so well before, I was starting to think I could like you.

Come on! Reasonable adults do discuss subjects in fiction all the time. If you're not interested then don't stick your nose into the conversation. I think you were one of the people that said that to me when I made a comment about a sports team.

by **pinback** » Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:19 pm

You're asking if Groundhog Day actually happened, what would happen?

That's what you're asking a group of people over the age of six?

by **Tdarcos** » Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:07 pm

Groundhog Day popularized a concept in fiction which had been explored in other movies that were no where near as popular.

For those of you who might have been in a cave, in Groundhog Day, Bill Murray is a reporter who has to cover the eponymous festival at Punxsutawney, Pennsylvania, then is stuck in town because of a blizzard, ends up staying overnight at a bed and breakfast, and wakes up at 6 AM to discover it's Groundhog Day all over again, and all the things that happened on the previous day are repeated. Eventually growing tired of this, he commits suicide only to wake up at 6:00 on Groundhog Day. He's stuck in a one-day endless time loop, repeating it over and over.

One movie, made several years earlier, called "12:01" has a man who accidentally shocked himself at the exact moment a nuclear reactor of a new design has a failure and has a huge explosion that destroys a large part of the world. He wakes up the next morning and eventually realizes he has to stop them from putting the reactor on line.

The latest one I'm aware of is Edge of Tomorrow where Tom Cruise, a military public relations officer, ends up as a soldier fighting extraterrestrials, and kills one that spills its bodily fluids, causing him to be reborn at the start of that morning if he is killed.

So, here is the question I'd like anyione here to answer on the poll and perhaps comment.

In the case of someone being stuck in a "Groundhog-Day" style loop, does the world continue when the person restarts only they jump to a parallel universe at the time that their day started, or does the world they were in end when they leave it?

On the "Groundhog Day" theory in fiction

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To infinity bakery and beyond!!!!!

On the "Groundhog Day" theory in fiction