Jolt Country

Yeah, great. Nothing else could have happened.

That was my point. We are derailing the subject. The 29 constants that have to be within a precise window for life to form and evolve to be "intelligent." I wouldn't classify a rock as intelligent .

I'm here to chew bubblegum and derail the subject. I still have gum, but I can do two things at once.

A swift smash, right here in the temple should do it.

raecoffey wrote: Sat Sep 02, 2023 7:09 am That was my point. We are derailing the subject. The 29 constants that have to be within a precise window for life to form and evolve to be "intelligent." I wouldn't classify a rock as intelligent .

A rock is not intelligent. A tree is not intelligent. A cow is not intelligent. A human is not intelligent. There is only intelligence.

You have separated the world into subjects and objects, and until you let go of that, we will never find common ground.

The only question along these lines I have ever asked anyone here is "what is experiencing this?" and nobody has come up with an answer other than the dearly (!) departed (?!?!) Tdarcos, who is convinced there is something between his ears and eyes that all of this is being presented to, and which is generating all of this intelligence, but even he has no idea what it is. Science doesn't know what it is. Nobody knows what it is.

So you've started with an assumption for which there is no evidence, and are questioning things based on that assumption. And based on that assumption, it is amazing that these 29 Constants exist to allow life to exist.

Dispelled of that assumption, I have no idea what you're talking about. Also a link would have been nice.

Flack wrote: Sun Aug 27, 2023 9:45 am In a normal world someone would say "here's an interesting article" and then post a link to the article and yet somehow I ended up in an alternate universe where people are arguing whether or not rocks are alive. Jesus, take me!

The exact same discussion appears in Michael Chrichton's 1969 book, The Andromeda Strain. As a thinking exercise, students in a class are asked to bring in three things not normally considered alive. Dutton brings in a black cloth, a rock, and something else, I don't remember what. The black cloth absorbs energy, same as other living things. The rock also, but its lifespan is several billion years. Our lifepan as compared to the rock is less than the length of a blink to us. Other discussions about them continue, the point of the exercise was to show that life might exist in ways we can't even imagine.

Whether rocks have intelligence, how would you determine that in an object that has a thought say, only once every 300 years? The rock might have very slow thought processes,

See, SOMEbody agrees with me!

He's back! And also not dead! Oh, happy day.

As to the 29 constants of the universe, all that it means if one or more were different is that life, as we know it could not exist. If some of them changed, maybe life is based on silicon instead of carbon, e.g. the Horta from Star Trek. Maybe room temperature is a very comfortable 700 degrees. Maybe the dominant lifeform on earth - or whatever took its place - is photosenitive like plants. The death penalty is inflicted by locking them in a pitch-black room.

All we can say is that the universe would not develop the same way as it did here. Stars and such as we know them won't develop the same way. Since the number of universe samples we in universe "A" have to study is 1, we can't have any real idea what would happen if some of them were different. In that universe "B", with an entirely different form of life, they're probably arguing if life could exist in a universe with the 29 constants having one or more settings different from theirs, who, in that universe "C", they're arguing whether life could exist in a universe with our settings or the setting in "B", and so on, and so on, and so on, ad infinitem.

Tdarcos wrote: Sat Sep 02, 2023 2:54 pm

Flack wrote: Sun Aug 27, 2023 9:45 am In a normal world someone would say "here's an interesting article" and then post a link to the article and yet somehow I ended up in an alternate universe where people are arguing whether or not rocks are alive. Jesus, take me!

The exact same discussion appears in Michael Chrichton's 1969 book, The Andromeda Strain. As a thinking exercise, students in a class are asked to bring in three things not normally considered alive. Dutton brings in a black cloth, a rock, and something else, I don't remember what. The black cloth absorbs energy, same as other living things. The rock also, but its lifespan is several billion years. Our lifepan as compared to the rock is less than the length of a blink to us. Other discussions about them continue, the point of the exercise was to show that life might exist in ways we can't even imagine.

Whether rocks have intelligence, how would you determine that in an object that has a thought say, only once every 300 years? The rock might have very slow thought processes,

I read a similar scientific paper that explained how witches are made of wood.

correct

Blah blah blah

There is something experiencing my intelligence and my consciousness right now,
ME, And I'm right here to tell you about it.

raecoffey wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 3:55 pm Blah blah blah

There is something experiencing my intelligence and my consciousness right now,
ME, And I'm right here to tell you about it.

Where and what is it? It hasn't been found by science or experience, so, tell me what this "me" is, and where it is.

A philosophical argument on my post now eh?

I am 'The Experiencer!' Aka
The one doing and recording
The experiences here are Blue mart.

There is no user.. there is only internet...

End users became an idea of the past,
Now it is all done in the cloud...

raecoffey wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 7:08 am A philosophical argument on my post now eh?

I am 'The Experiencer!' Aka
The one doing and recording
The experiences here are Blue mart.

It's not philosophical at all. Everyone has ideas and thoughts about the "me" or the "experiencer" or the "witness". That's philosophical.

Nobody can find it, though, so maybe it's time to drop that assumption.

Nobody would get so worked up and nervous if they realized there wasn't anyone.

Clearly intelligent rocks

pinback wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 3:22 pm

raecoffey wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 7:08 am A philosophical argument on my post now eh?

I am 'The Experiencer!' Aka
The one doing and recording
The experiences here are Blue mart.

It's not philosophical at all. Everyone has ideas and thoughts about the "me" or the "experiencer" or the "witness". That's philosophical.

Nobody can find it, though, so maybe it's time to drop that assumption.

Nobody would get so worked up and nervous if they realized there wasn't anyone.

"The Observer" is the basis of all quantum mechanics. Only the Observer can collapse the wave-function and make light exhibit its wave-particle duality.