Does Lysander need medication?

[Lysander]

So, I turned 19 a few weeks ago. As a birthday present, my mom gives me a psychological evaluation. Apparently my predilection for keeping a messy room and forgetting to turn in homework assignments is an indication of a serious mental problem. So, surprise surprise, I get diagnosed with ADHD, inattentive type! So would that be, like, ADHD catigory I? Something like that. Anyway, so now I'm sure the next step is that people will start suggesting pills which, because I live waaaay the fuck up in Alaska, will cost 300 dollars a month. That's what's been happening in "my life," folks. Weee.

[pinback]

I've written two long, meandering, whiny posts on here already tonight, and kept myself from hitting "post" both times.

This is the "new pinback".

[chris]

So, I turned 19 a few weeks ago. As a birthday present, my mom gives me a psychological evaluation. Apparently my predilection for keeping a messy room and forgetting to turn in homework assignments is an indication of a serious mental problem. So, surprise surprise, I get diagnosed with ADHD, inattentive type! So would that be, like, ADHD catigory I? Something like that. Anyway, so now I'm sure the next step is that people will start suggesting pills which, because I live waaaay the fuck up in Alaska, will cost 300 dollars a month. That's what's been happening in "my life," folks. Weee.

Personally, I think ADHD is a load of bullshit. Just because some people keep a messy room and can't concentrate on doing 50 things at once (which modern society seems to require) doesn't mean that they need to be stuffed full of pills to fix their "problem". Of the people I've known that were "diagnosed" with ADHD, all of them were spending their time focusing on unimportant crap and forgetting the important stuff. All they needed was a good swift kick in the ass to straighten them out.

Simplify your life, remove unnecessary distractions, and you'll be fine.

[pinback]

Over the past six months or so (maybe more -- who can remember?), I feel like I have been experiencing the onset of something which vaguely resembles the descriptions I've read for ADD (or ADHD, I guess? I dunno the difference.)

Among the senior set, this condition might rather be referred to as "CRS", or "Can't Remember Shit", but in my case, it is more specifically characterized by the "flitting of the mind"; inability to focus on one particular concept/task for more than a few seconds, before it flutters away to alight upon the next thing, and then too only for a few fleeting moments.

Examples of this problem's manifestation are too numerous to mention (or in my case, remember). Things which we've all experienced, but perhaps not on such a regular, routine basis:

1. Go from room A to room B, forget why you went in there.

2. Leave the house to go to the recycling center, but leaving the recycling materials back in the house.

3. Wanting to post something on JC, but by the time you get there, you don't remember what it is you were going to post about.

One could chalk these examples up to simple forgetfulness, or the onset of early Alzheimers, but the point is that at the time the realization of the "forgettation" happens, my mind is not empty, but instead reeling with a hundred other thoughts bounding about almost randomly in my head. I went from room A to room B to get a screwdriver to fix some shelves, but when I get to room B, I am trying to figure out a yearly budget in my head, or coming up with a pork loin recipe, or fretting about depression, or one of my other favorite hobbies. Inability to focus is the common theme.

This is especially troubling in my new job, where I'm faced with the task of having to gain expertise in countless unfamiliar technologies, and seemingly all at the same time. This does nothing but worsen the effects of this condition, because it's a situation which naturally encourages this kind of lack of focus.

One starts to learn about Active Directory, a daunting task even if it was the only one on your plate, but you're instantly sidetracked by fifteen other acronyms you've never seen before -- MIIS, ASDI, ADAM, WMI, WSH, etc, etc., each of which carries you on to a new reference material, which you read for five more minutes until being thrown in seven other directions. An hour later, not only can you not remember anything you learned about AD in the first place, you can barely recall what AD stands for, or why you're staring at the book in the first place, or when you're going to get your car taken care of, or how you're going to pay your taxes, or how you wish you'd talked to that girl back in the fourth grade that one time, or flit, flit, flit, flit...

Whether this is a clinical condition, or simply a troublesome state of being caused by transitory environmental (or mental) conditions, hard to say.

It's damn annoying, though.

[Casual Observer]

Most people I've known who were diagnosed with ADHD just ended up selling their Ritilin pills to the other kids.

[pinback]

(From Wikipedia:)

Studies have indicated that adults with ADD are much more likely to have substance abuse problems than adults who do not have ADD. They are also more likely to suffer from depression and anxiety, be fired from jobs, and get divorced than non-ADHD adults.

Well, alright! Now we're getting somewhere!

[pinback]

Let's take the test!
----------------------
For adults, the most common symptom is a sense of underachieving. No matter how well you are doing, you always have a sense of missing a lot in work, school, jobs relationships. (Ed note: And how!) That is what most often finally brings adults in for diagnosis and treatment.

The Hallowell Center provides the following possible indicators to consider in an individual when ADD is suspected. If you have exhibited at least twelve of the following behaviors since childhood and if these symptoms are not associated with any other medical or psychiatric condition, consider an evaluation by a team of ADD/ADHD professionals.

1. A sense of underachievement, of not meeting one’s goals (regardless of how much one has actually accomplished).

Absolutely!!

2. Difficulty getting organized.

Hoo-boy, tell me about it!

3. Chronic procrastination or trouble getting started.

It's like he's describing ME.

4. Many projects going simultaneously; trouble with follow through.

Didn't I just talk about this earlier?

5. A tendency to say what comes to mind without necessarily considering the timing or appropriateness of the remark.

This I don't do, because I rarely, if ever, say anything.

6. A frequent search for high stimulation.

Heh. Hehehe.

7. An intolerance of boredom.

Hard to say here. Sitting at the bar all day might look boring, but it's just me searching for high stimulation.

8. Easy distractibility; trouble focusing attention, tendency to tune out or drift away in the middle of a page or conversation, often coupled with an inability to focus at times.

It took me three tries to just read #8 all the way through!

9. Often creative, intuitive, highly intelligent

This goes without saying.

10. Trouble in going through established channels and following “proper” procedure.

Uhh. I dunno. Yes?

11. Impatient; low tolerance of frustration.

Is this quiz EVER going to end?!?! SHIT!!!!

12. Impulsive, either verbally or in action, as an impulsive spending of money.

Not really. Not particularly impulsive, because, again, I never do or say anything.

13. Changing plans, enacting new schemes or career plans and the like; hot-tempered.

I've lived in five different states in the past year and a half.

14. A tendency to worry needlessly, endlessly; a tendency to scan the horizon looking for something to worry about, alternating with attention to or disregard for actual dangers.

Dagger in my heart, baby.

15. A sense of insecurity.

HAhahaha. ME?! INSECURE?!?!?

16. Mood swings, mood instability, especially when disengaged from a person or a project.

Ehh. Maybe. I'm usually so morose all the time anyway, it's hard to tell.

17. Physical or cognitive restlessness.

Yes.

18. A tendency toward addictive behavior.

Hehehehe.

19. Chronic problems with self-esteem.

HAHAHAHAHAhaahhaah.

20. Inaccurate self-observation.

BWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHahahahha.

21. Family history of AD/HD or manic depressive illness or depression or substance abuse or other disorders of impulse control or mood.

Tee hee.

============

Right, let's count 'em up! Giving me the benefit of the doubt, I count: 15 out of 21.

15 > 12.

I need help!

[bruce]

Will your insurance pay for it?

Because Ritalin's speed, and speed's fun. So I hear.

Bruce

[pinback]

Well, for ADD folks, it has the opposite effect. It chills you the hell out. The science goes:

1. ADD people have an excess of dopamine (yummy) production centers.

2. To counteract this excess, the brain does not utilize them efficiently, and ends up tossing a bunch of it away.

3. Ritalin shuts off some of the dopamine production centers.

4. Which encourages the brain to use the dope more efficiently, and thereby chilling you the hell out.

[pinback]

If you have exhibited at least twelve of the following behaviors since childhood and if these symptoms are not associated with any other medical or psychiatric condition, consider an evaluation by a team of ADD/ADHD professionals.

See, that's the trick here, upon further reflection. It would seem to me that most of those questions would also be a relevant test of whether or not someone was subject to clinical depression, rather than attention-deficit disorders.

Methinks the two may in fact be inextricably entwined, at least in a great many cases. Whether it's a causal relationship, or perhaps a matter of semantics, hard to say.

[chris]

Over the past six months or so (maybe more -- who can remember?), I feel like I have been experiencing the onset of something which vaguely resembles the descriptions I've read for ADD (or ADHD, I guess? I dunno the difference.)

It's called "21st century adulthood". I've been that way for a while now (being a bit absent-minded at times), but I'm working on it.

I mean, look at our lives. We get up (after getting less sleep than we need), and usually have to hurry to get to work on time (and fighting traffic on the way). We're under pressure at work to do a million things at once. We have to then go home (again fighting traffic) and worry about all of the things there (shopping, making dinner, paying bills, fixing/cleaning/whatever all of our stuff), etc. Nothing is *simple* anymore. You can't even turn on the TV and chill.....it has 600 channels and a remote with 50 bazillion buttons on it. And don't even get me started on how complex computers have gotten...they're certainly not the refuge from life's complexities that they used to be.

Is it any wonder that we all have so much on our minds, and can't concentrate on anything anymore? We're simply not designed to constantly deal with that much crap, and the end result is that we just can't concentrate on anything. The "ADD/ADHD professionals" you describe (and THAT term made me chuckle) just prescribe drugs, cause you know, drugs will fix whatever ails ya.

The real solution is to simplify you life so you DON'T have so much crap to deal with. Make sure you get 8 hours of sleep every night. Remove some stress by getting yourself organized (like make shopping lists before you go to the grocery store, or make a list of things you want/need to do this weekend, or whatnot). Go out to eat (or order in) once or twice a week so you don't have to constantly cook, or make meals in advance so you'll have quick meals at your disposal. Get up a little earlier in the morning so you don't have to rush out of the house. Better yet, spend time each day doing something that doesn't require you to think, like going for a walk, or taking a hot bath, or whatever makes ya happy. Just giving your brain a little downtime each day does wonders.

[Knuckles the Sandwich]

The real solution is . . .

You could also just try jerking off more.

[pinback]

I mean, look at our lives.

Well, yes. There is merit, I think, to what you're saying here. However, I'm not so willing to completely toss the idea that there are other, neurological (as opposed to environmental) forces at work here.

One thing that makes me think this is that AADD symptoms were described decades ago, long before the average schmo had ever seen a computer, much less had one in his home. Certainly traffic and work hassles have been a standard part of modern life for centuries, but cavemen fretted all day about getting eaten by roving carnivorous beasts, so who are we to complain about that?

Another thing that makes me think this is that the time during which I experienced myself getting worse and worse were also the same times when 1) I didn't have a job. 2) I didn't need a job. 3) I could sleep as long as I want. 4) My life was utterly complication-free, following whatever my next whim was from dawn to dusk. (In general, I highly recommend this way of living, if you can swing it.)

No, there's something else at work here, and neurological studies have borne that out. My own personal hypothesis is that in many cases, these symptoms are not simply symptoms of some newfangled, faddish syndrome called "AADD" (or "ADHD" or "ADD" or whatever the hell), but are instead comingling symptoms of clinical depression.

Just off the cuff, I can come up with an example in my own life which may demonstrate how one can be confused for another, or how one and the other are actually the exact same things. Here:

I have trouble starting things. The reason I have trouble starting things is that, like any good depressive, I realize that starting something is just another opportunity to fail, and as any failure is taken as a monstrous, life-threatening ego hit, it is absolutely unacceptable to assume this level of risk.

Take this same pattern (A: identify task B: avoid task) and throw it into an overactive mind, add a lack of outside stimuli, and I think it could ratchet itself up to megahertz-level clock cycles, as your mind flips from one failure-avoidance scheme to the next, just searching for quiet, searching for solace, searching for a way out. Switching to the next thought is just a way to run from the first one. (In the same way that, for some, switching to the next street address is just a way to run from the previous one.)

Not saying any of that is true or scientifically valid. Just an idea.

[Knuckles the CLown]

So, I turned 19 a few weeks ago. As a birthday present, my mom gives me a psychological evaluation. Apparently my predilection for keeping a messy room and forgetting to turn in homework assignments is an indication of a serious mental problem. So, surprise surprise, I get diagnosed with ADHD, inattentive type! So would that be, like, ADHD catigory I? Something like that. Anyway, so now I'm sure the next step is that people will start suggesting pills which, because I live waaaay the fuck up in Alaska, will cost 300 dollars a month. That's what's been happening in "my life," folks. Weee.

How about you move out of the house you tit-clutcher. Pick up a weapon or get a job! The best way to get your parents off your back is move out and then move back in at like age 27 when they finnaly miss you and your attempts at independant life has failed you.

Seriously though You don't have a problem, eveyone else does. It takes about 5 hours longer to get anything done on this hell hole of a planet then it should take. People that accept this have adapted in a pathetic way, people who haven't get diagnosed with ADD.

Example
Authority: "Johnny, You mean you don't want to got to college for 8 years to become a Gym teacher"

"Um isn't it just rolling a couple balls out and making sure nobody gets hurt, I can't concetrate for 8 years to learn something I already know how to do"

Authority "ADD!!!!!!!!!!"

I find people diagnosed with ADD are people that have trouble sitting around and listening to "inteligent" people babble on endlessly. These people think anyone that doesn't have 10 hours to listen to them analyze a logic prrof must have a disease. It's interest. Show a kid a five hour film on the techniques of tit-fucking and he'll watch and retain. Stick him in a seat and show a tape of Chris in his wood shop or Ice Cream Jonsey's arteries hardening and it's SNOOOOZERS!

[Knuckles the CLown]

Oh, I must have ADD because I can't get more than two lines into any of pinback's post without wanting to shoot myself.

[Lysander]

Most people I've known who were diagnosed with ADHD just ended up selling their Ritilin pills to the other kids.

Well, it probably won't be that, it'll probably be Dexidrene, which is like, riddalin for adults. Good idea though!

[Lysander]

I mean, look at our lives. We get up (after getting less sleep than we need),

I get too mcuh sleep. My school schedule is ridiculously light this year.

and usually have to hurry to get to work on time (and fighting traffic on
the way).

No, and no.

We're under pressure at work to do a million things at once.

Nope. My classes are two music classes, a study hall period, and a bullshit vocational class i had to take because i didn', like, take enough Shop classes in previous years. Can't imagine why no one wanted the blind guy around a table saw.

We have to then go home (again fighting traffic) and worry about all of the things there (shopping, making dinner, paying bills, fixing/cleaning/whatever all of our stuff), etc.

Nope. Because I live at home, and I give you all fifteen seconds to get those snickers out of your system--are you all done now? Good.--I dont' have to worry aobut... really, any of those things.

I'm not trying to be anal by picking at all your little points here, I'm trying ot make a point that right now, my life is easy. I am right now at a maximum of lazyness, lack of responsibilities, and thigns to deal with. So why, with all this leway, would i still get diagnosed with this? Besides the fact that docs like to sell drugs, I mean.

[Lysander]

How about you move out of the house you tit-clutcher. Pick up a weapon or get a job! The best way to get your parents off your back is move out and then move back in at like age 27 when they finnaly miss you and your attempts at independant life has failed you.

Hah. I repeat, hah. Pause to regain composure from side-splitting hysterics. Then continue.

I'm moving out in July. I would have moved out last July, but my parents are for some reason scared of hte prospect of the blind kid who lived on a small island all his life going to teh big bad citty! I'm not worried, personally. I mean I am, but not more than I should be.

Show a kid a five hour film on the techniques of tit-fucking and he'll watch and retain. Stick him in a seat and show a tape of Chris in his wood shop or Ice Cream Jonsey's arteries hardening and it's SNOOOOZERS!

If you don't mind, I'm going to be using that argument tomorrow at the big round table let's all pick on lysander's mental problems meeting. THX~!11!

[AArdvark]

I like the Doug Adams theory postulated in 'Long Dark Tea-time of the Soul'

..Well, I can't find the book to quote exactly, but it goes along the lines that the human mind has only six memory registers and that thinking about any six things at once is all well and good but think about a seventh thing and one of the other thoughts just dissapears. Thus, you walk into a room thinking about ;
- Fixing the shelf in the other room;
- How come the cheap shelves you have are falling apaprt;
- How much money could you make if you moved out of Colorodo;
- The price of pizza in any Colorodo town;
- The blizzard that is keeping you from the overpriced pizza;
- How cold is a witch's tit anyway;
- What is this screwdriver doing in your hand;
This is in accordance with our multi-tasking environment we place ourselves in on a daily basis. I doubt we have evolved enough to keep up with our technology and that makes us depressed as a species, some more than others.


THE
NEURONS ARE
SPARKING
BUT THE LAWN MOWER
WONT START
AARDVARK

[chris]

Oh, I must have ADD because I can't get more than two lines into any of pinback's post without wanting to shoot myself.

Bwa-ha-ha-ha-ha, BEST OF!